Darren is back!

[luise]

I was just checking out the entries for Genesee Valley Hunt HT here in Area 1, and see that Darren Chiacchia has 2 prelim entries and a training entry.

[poopoo]

That seems awfully soon after a bad head injury. Those things are cumulative.....

[LexInVA]

Let's just hope he stays together.

[nirvana002]

As much as I want to support Darren, it is clear he is not right. The combination at Red Hills was not a 5 stride.. the long option was. The way Darren went was a 2 stride( he was right about the jump itself) the long way was a bending 5. Also, Ruthie Harbison was the rider before him and went the straight way. For those of you who want to question what I am saying, I was competing and walked the course..and his family showed me the video in the hospital the day they got it. It was a 2...Darrens horse jumped off the bank, slightly right, Darren being the great jockey..pulled him back left..and in the horse's inexperience, he tried to put in 3 strides(which couldn't be done) That is all there was to it. It worries me a bit that Darren does not know what the striding was after watching the video "over and over". I hope that quote from Darren was a misprint by the Chronicle, or someone needs to be looking after Darren more closely.
Jill

[silver2]

This seems like a spectacularly bad idea. I sincerely hope he is not allowed to compete so soon after a Grade V concussion + a week long coma.

Most sports organisations, amateur or professional, would not allow this.

[ezmissg]

As much as I want to support Darren, it is clear he is not right. The combination at Red Hills was not a 5 stride.. the long option was. The way Darren went was a 2 stride( he was right about the jump itself) the long way was a bending 5. Also, Ruthie Harbison was the rider before him and went the straight way. For those of you who want to question what I am saying, I was competing and walked the course..and his family showed me the video in the hospital the day they got it. It was a 2...Darrens horse jumped off the bank, slightly right, Darren being the great jockey..pulled him back left..and in the horse's inexperience, he tried to put in 3 strides(which couldn't be done) That is all there was to it. It worries me a bit that Darren does not know what the striding was after watching the video "over and over". I hope that quote from Darren was a misprint by the Chronicle, or someone needs to be looking after Darren more closely.
Jill


Glad to see I wasn't the only one who noticed this when I read his piece in the COTH. I walked that course, and I remember it being a tight 2.

I also saw Darren at the summit, and I was concerned that he still seemed ...ummm ...frail.

He did note that he has been "cleared" to compete, but these scenarios sure make me apprehensive about the whole thing....

[piaffeprincess98]

I thought his COTH article said he would start at the "lower levels". I just knew he didn't mean novice with Windfall! But I expected training or below with his greenies.

[J Swan]

There was a pretty long article in COTH recently; he's been cleared to ride by 2 neurologists.

Make of it what you will.

[sidepasser]

Isn't it true that many people have no recollection of the events leading up to an accident (right before/during/right after) due to the brain sort of turning off the trauma? Perhaps I am not explaining it very well, but when I had my life threatening accident, I remember a few hazy details such as getting on the mare, she took about ten steps at the walk, and the next thing I remember is waking up in the hospital days later.

I was TOLD that the mare exploded, violently bucking/sunfishing, and then cartwheeled over and landed on top of me, her croup landing on my neck and head - but I do not remember anything of that at all.

Perhaps Darren has the same thing going on regarding the striding? At any rate, if he's been cleared to compete by doctors, I am sure they would not put him in harm's way intentionally and perhaps Darren needs to "go back to work" as I do believe he derives his income from riding/training and this accident, like mine, has likely depleted much of his money.

I wish him well and hope that he continues to ride successfully. Coming back from any accident is very hard, coming back from one such as his isn't easier if one continues to wait. I do believe it gives one too much time to think and question resulting in a less likely scenario of riding and becoming more apprehensive about giving it a go.

[shea'smom]

Well, I think if he has been cleared by his doctors, he should be good to go. I hope things go well for him.
I do think one horse to start with would be better.

[horsekpr]

I find it a bit scarey.Sure he needs to work and make money,but if he has another fall ,doesn't even have to be bad,so soon after such a massive head trauma,who knows if he will ever recover.On his website he says something like he was in a coma for 65 days.Now he wasn't actually in a coma for more than a week,but he feels like it took that long to snap out of it,so that tells me his brain was pretty scrambled. I agree that someone should be watching out for him.I mean,it is his choice,but he might not have the best judgement right now. Probably like most men,he isn't going to listen to anyone.

[Fence2Fence]

Like everyone else, I wish him well and to be blessed with the best of health and riding.

[ValleyMiss]

I was glad to hear from his column in COTH that he was doing better and getting back to riding. However I do have to agree that it seems a bit premature to be riding 2 prelim horses and a training horse in his first time back. And you know what's wrong with taking a horse novice or training, even a trained horse that has competed upper levels? That was a MAJOR injury he had just 4 months ago. I honestly have to question him doing so much so soon.

[deltawave]

A doctor can't really "clear" anyone to do anything in the sense that by declaring someone "cleared" they can't impart any sort of magical protection. A doctor can only discuss risk vs. benefit, outline the pros and cons, and let the individual make a choice.

Now in the setting of a professional sport (say football) it's different, and the team doctor can make a declaration that a player MAY or MAY NOT compete. That is a contractual on top of an ethical issue on top of a medical issue on top of a liability issue.

I have no way at all of knowing, nor am I even remotely expert on the current recommendations regarding return to competition after closed head injury, but I'd wager that Darren has made his own choice and his doctors have given him their conditional "approval" only after making sure he realizes the risk. A doctor can't, after all, bodily prevent him from riding.

Personally, I think it's insane. But that's a non-expert opinion.

[Old Time Rider]

Speaking from experience (stroke victum), hind sight is 20/20, and I wish Darren well. But, neurologists have book knowledge and no personal experience of what really is going. Unless they ride event horses, they have absolutely no idea the physical-mental-balance-timing etc etc involved in riding an event horse. And while I understand Darren's wanting to get his life back (and it's not just a man thing), I do pray he's ready to compete.

[canterlope]

Like he said in his article, "no one tells me what to do." Too bad his horses don't have the same privilege.

[flutie1]

I wish him well, not only for himself and his horses, but for eventing as a whole. The ramifications if it all goes south are horrendous for an already troubled sport. We desperately need a "return to play" policy such as that in place for soccer, football, NASCAR, etc.

[goobs]

Well "cleared to ride" is a very broad statement - are his doctors "horsey" as in do they know the mental acuity and the physical demand it takes to do a horse trial (even at the lower levels you need all your faculties about you 100%).

Darren takes very good care of himself but he doesn't have to be superman just yet - then again he is an adult and he does have a business to get back to - I hope he will be okay not only at this venue but for the next year that he is showing.

[sidepasser]

Who would determine that "return to play" policy? If doctors say a person can ride, then where is the argument that one cannot? Your idea of return to play and mine might be years apart. I might want to return in six months while someone else says a year, others say 18 months, etc.

[veezee]

If he has had two neurologist clear him then what more can he do. He needs to live his life to the fullest as he has learned each day is precious and if he needs to keep riding and competing than so be it. It's his life and we can only hope things go safely and wish him the best.:)

[c_expresso]

Flame me if you will, but it comes of as pretentious and careless to have a horrific wreck at preliminary on a questionably ready horse, and then be back with two at prelim as soon as possible.

[Classic Melody]

And we have wondered where Laine got her "return to the top as soon as possible at any cost" attitude. It’s clearly pervasive at the upper echelon of the sport.

[silver pine]

This is crazy. Given the nature of his brain injury- and that is what it is, everyone keeps calling is a concission as if that makes it less bad, he is brain injured! The nature of his brain injury prevents good decision making, some people are forever unable to make good decisions and others get better and better at it as time goes by. The ability to make sound decision in an instant can take years and infact may neve come back at all. He may be cognativley intact enough to make good dicisions in day to day life- which is wonderful and for which we are all very thankful- but to do that over a prelim and above course is a whole other story. I'm fairly sure every Neurologist I have come accross (I'm a physical therapist) would not know the first thing about eventing or the mental acuity involved.

As some one else has pointed out who makes the return to play decisions for the ULR's? Should there be a "vetting" of the rider as well as the horse. The horse needs to be of sound mind and body and its about time the rider met the same criteria!

[pwynnnorman]

As much as I want to support Darren, it is clear he is not right. The combination at Red Hills was not a 5 stride.. the long option was. The way Darren went was a 2 stride( he was right about the jump itself) the long way was a bending 5. Also, Ruthie Harbison was the rider before him and went the straight way. For those of you who want to question what I am saying, I was competing and walked the course..and his family showed me the video in the hospital the day they got it. It was a 2...Darrens horse jumped off the bank, slightly right, Darren being the great jockey..pulled him back left..and in the horse's inexperience, he tried to put in 3 strides(which couldn't be done) That is all there was to it. It worries me a bit that Darren does not know what the striding was after watching the video "over and over". I hope that quote from Darren was a misprint by the Chronicle, or someone needs to be looking after Darren more closely.
Jill

Wow, Jill. Wow, wow. I am just amazed you've posted this NOW. Amazed, amazed, amazed that it has finally (?) come out. Did you note this in any other discussion?

I'm not by any means questioning its veracity. But, geezum, that information would have been extremely significant in a LOT of discussions that have taken place.

[On Second Thought]

If he has had two neurologist clear him then what more can he do. He needs to live his life to the fullest as he has learned each day is precious and if he needs to keep riding and competing than so be it. It's his life and we can only hope things go safely and wish him the best.:)

Seriously? I mean I could see this being a plausibly acceptable argument if Darren was entering a mechanical bull competition, or mountain biking down a totally abandoned trail.

That is not the case. As Canterlope said, this sport involves another sentient being who has no say in the decision, but in the end can pay the ultimate price.

I have no doubt that if Darren's mount could speak he would look at him and say "Dude, you're kinda tweaked. Everyone knows you're still NQR, I ain't so much as jumping a stick with you as a pilot." (all said with some sort of charming accent I'm sure).

But alas, that can't happen.

I do sincerely hope that everyone is wrong; that the impression he's leaving people with is a misperception, and this isn't as colossal of a bad decision as it seems.

[flutie1]

Flame me if you will, but it comes of as pretentious and careless to have a horrific wreck at preliminary on a questionably ready horse, and then be back with two at prelim as soon as possible.

I believe he's also entered OI at Stuart the next weekend.

[AppJumpr08]

It does seem too soon after such an injury.

All I can say is that I'm keeping fingers and toes crossed that he and his horses get around safely...

[SparklePlenty]

Just to throw this out as a thought..<flame suit on>

Maybe he's not planning on doing all 3 phases! Many times people just go and ride dressage and warm up for stadium and not compete. And maybe this is just his way of "getting back out there" and getting his legs back underneath of him.

I'd like to think that someone like Darren who preaches saftey in eventing, who is on the saftey commitee has a logical reason for competing so high so soon. but then again have any of us seen him ride lately? do any of us know what he is capable of? Or are we only going by what we have read on COTH (as well as making assumptions)... maybe it was like getting back on a bike for him and he really is fine to compete.

Side note: I had a tramatic head injury back in 96 and it took me less then 3 months to return to normal...

I wish him the best of luck..

[magnolia73]

I don't know- he seems like one of those very fit, very mentally strong types. I assume he has been out jumping jumps and practicing the skills needed to negotiate two prelim courses. I assume he has the fitness as well. If he is doing prelim on his advanced horses- that is jumping back a few levels.

I doubt he is heading out to run two prelim courses after popping over a few cross rails at home. It sounds like from the article he is working with at least 3 good people.

[nirvana002]

Wow, Jill. Wow, wow. I am just amazed you've posted this NOW. Amazed, amazed, amazed that it has finally (?) come out. Did you note this in any other discussion?

I'm not by any means questioning its veracity. But, geezum, that information would have been extremely significant in a LOT of discussions that have taken place.

I didn't think it was right at the time because his family showed me the video in their time of grief before they even knew if Darren was going to survive. My post was only in response to reading his article. Even if he has been cleared by his doctors, it concerns me that somewhere perhaps things are not completely connecting for him mentally.
Jill

[Pixie Dust]

Well at least his doesn't have on his blog a post from his mom about how beautiful he is.

[FlightCheck]

I watched Baron at Rocking Horse the weekend before.

I was one of those who mumbled to themselves when he was at RH the next week.

At Red Hills, I saw them at the top of the bank, looked left, heard the fall, looked back to the right, (I will not describe what I then saw).

I held Darren's hand and spoke to him until medics arrived.

I spoke to him at the Safety Summit.

I listened to his speech at the Safety Summit.


I don't believe that he wrote that article without help. I don't believe that he is mentally or physically recovered.

It doesn't matter what I think, because I am no one in a positition of authority.

[bambam]

I wish him well and hope it works out- for both his sake and the sake of the sport
Seems like a frighteningly bad decision to me :no::no::no:

[Beth Rasin]

Not commenting on Darren's ability to compete or decision to do so, however, after sending his article in, he did call us back a week or so later, having realized his error in the story regarding the striding. He told us then that he was wrong, it was two strides and his horse tried to do three, but the magazine had already gone to press and couldn't be changed. So he does realize it's not five strides. No one here had walked that prelim course and could know if he was wrong or not, so we had to take his word.

[Fence2Fence]

I hope Jill and Flightcheck will call Darren up, email him, or write him a letter--something--, and say these very things to him.

[silver pine]

Ok so all thi stalk of saftey at teh lowe levels and red flags, watch lists ect. Do you mean to tell me the Darren should not be on a watch list?

Should there be a USEA or USEF physician who makes the fianl decision on ULR's following catastrophic injury?

Here is a perfect example of an ULR making a poor decision and the powers that be turning a blind eye- all those BN and N riders are sooo hazardous afterall!

People do make full recoveries after TBI and I hope Darren is one of those few lucky people but come on, 4 months.

If he was entered in an event on my property I whould feel compelled to decline for saftey reasons- what happens to eventing if he gets himself or his horse injured or killed. Hello USEA higher ups wake up!! Pay attention to what is going on at the upper levels, this is clearly a case where a rider needs to ride in order to make a living- but at what cost to the horses.
I have a very bad feeling about this.....

[3dazey]

Nirvana, what you have bravely commented on here I have heard recently corroborated by ULRs who would certainly be in a position to know. According to what was said, all is not perfectly well...I hope wiser heads are in on this decision and everything is okay, but if not, PLEASE someone speak up who is in a position to stop another possible tragedy. The thought of it makes me physically ill.

[Jazzy Lady]

At least his prelim horses he has entered are Windfall and Gus (Better I do it). And his training horse is Fantastik. Who's pretty straight forward at training level.

I mean... nobody has had luck telling the man 'no' yet... he's only doing local (NY) stuff on his experienced horses right now. The green one's are not being ridden by him and he's not going beyond prelim for a little bit.

He's not entered at Stuart.

Ya it's scary, ya, he had a bad fall. Is it the best idea, who knows? Only those who know the situation very well can make the call. I get my information from one of his students who is a close friend and who's mother is a close friend of his. They worry for him of course, but he's a grown man.

I wish him lots of safety, strong judgement skills, and luck of course :)

[RAyers]

I will not comment on Darren's decision.

The data indicates that a person with TBI is almost 2 TIMES more likely to be killed in a subsequent head impact (even if it is only a mild impact) due to the accumulative effects of concussion (second impact syndrome).

According to the American Academy of Neurologists (with bold added by me),

"Grade 3 Concussion:

Definition: Loss of consciousness, either brief (seconds) or prolonged (minutes or longer).
Management: The athlete should be removed from sports activity for 1 full week without symptoms if the loss of consciousness is brief, or 2 full weeks without symptoms if the loss of consciousness is prolong. If still unconscious, or if abnormal neurologic signs are present at the time of initial evaluation, the athlete should be transported by ambulance to the nearest hospital emergency department. An athlete who suffers a second Grade 3 concussion should be removed from sports activity until asymptomatic for 1 month. Any athlete with an abnormality on computed tomography or magnetic resonance imaging brain scan consistent with brain swelling, contusion, or other intracranial pathology should be removed from sports activities for the season and discouraged from future return to participation in contact sports."

I agree that Darren should be on a watch list, for many YEARS if only for his own welfare.

Reed

[RunForIt]

Nirvana, what you have bravely commented on here I have heard recently corroborated by ULRs who would certainly be in a position to know. According to what was said, all is not perfectly well...I hope wiser heads are in on this decision and everything is okay, but if not, PLEASE someone speak up who is in a position to stop another possible tragedy. The thought of it makes me physically ill.

There's also a "tragedy" in that someone very well known, someone who in another time has been one of our country's top event riders, now clearly making another poor judgement call that will impact our sport regardless if Darren gets around all 3 phases.

I personally want participants in our sport to be perceived as horsemen and women who make good decisions even when our own needs/aspirations go unmet. Darren's lack of judgement can be attributed to his severe head injury. The USEA cannot lay claim to the same reason - someone with the authority to do so needs to call Darren and tell him he is not going to be allowed to ride in recognized horse trials at this point - I would think USEA officials have a responsibility to us all to do no less. JMHO

[silver pine]

"Any athlete with an abnormality on computed tomography or magnetic resonance imaging brain scan consistent with brain swelling, contusion, or other intracranial pathology should be removed from sports activities for the season and discouraged from future return to participation in contact sports."

Excellent post Reed. These guidelines are for the saftey of the individual and I suppose it'sup to the individual to do what they will with medical information.
What about the saftey of the horse who is subject to said individual's decisions? There needs to be a "vetting" of sorts...

[FoxChaser]

"If he was entered in an event on my property I whould feel compelled to decline for saftey reasons- what happens to eventing if he gets himself or his horse injured or killed. Hello USEA higher ups wake up!! Pay attention to what is going on at the upper levels, this is clearly a case where a rider needs to ride in order to make a living- but at what cost to the horses."

Silver pine, FlightCheck, and everyone else who is concerned (myself included), maybe we should all send some e-mail Kevin Baumgardner's way stating the above. Maybe somebody should tap the USEA on the shoulder and suggest that this isn't such a good idea? Maybe someone on the current safety committee should talk to Darren and point this out to him. It's all well and good to armchair quarterback, but maybe someone should be brave enough to actually say something to someone who has some sway?

[pwynnnorman]

I didn't think it was right at the time because his family showed me the video in their time of grief before they even knew if Darren was going to survive. My post was only in response to reading his article. Even if he has been cleared by his doctors, it concerns me that somewhere perhaps things are not completely connecting for him mentally.
Jill

I understand what you are implying about his mental state. Have you spoken with him about it? I mean, I really appreciate the information you imparted, but it IS a bit of a whopper, don't you think--given the discussions that have taken place? And I will admit, I do think it would have been better aired sooner--maybe not immediately after, but while all the ULR vs. LLR haranging was going on, for sure.

Again, what I mean is, that was a mistake I'm sure a LOT of, especially kinda ambitious, riders might make, wouldn't you say? IF that is what happened with Darren, what a useful example for younger riders. One of those "See, even a highly skilled rider can make a striding/line/track/approach mistake. That's why you need more mileage before moving up" kind of discussion openings. Y'know what I mean?

[SuperOtto]

I agree that it's a bad decision - I know every head injury is different, but when I had my accident, it was MONTHS before I felt like I was really recovered. I was slower at processing any type of information for a long time, and my injury was much, much less severe than Darren's. I can't imagine him being able to make the split second decisions that need to be made on a cross country course.

[Jazzy Lady]

So, I know I wished him the best, whatever, and safety, because I know that nobody (except those with the power) can actually stop him when he has his mind set on something...

Is this indicative of a leadership that won't look out for the riders? Does the USEA have say in this case? I mean, for training level I guess, but wouldn't it fall into the lap of the USEF for his prelim horses? Are they legally allowed to stop a "qualified" rider from entering? Do they even know that he's entering until the show is even over and the results are sent in to the USEF???

[Ajierene]

As far as doctor's clearing him to ride - Doctor's don't clear people for anything. They say 'you really shouldn't do that' or 'that might be ok', they do not say 'ok, your good to go!' Not unless they are POSITIVE. Another question to ask would be what was the exact conversation. Was it:

Darren : you think I am good enough to ride?
Doctor: yes, you should be alright for some light riding, but take it easy.
Darren: OK, I am going to take three horses to a horse trial - I will take it easy by doing Prelim and Training instead of some higher levels.
Doctor: um....that's not what I meant.
Darren: See you in a month!

or

Darren: I want to start competing soon.
Doctor: Well, you can start riding and if that is ok, try a competition.
Darren: OK, off to enter three horses.
Doctor: um....not what I meant...

OR

Darren: I really need to get back to work - two horses at Prelim, one at Training be ok?
Doctor: Just take it one horse at a time, but it should be fine.

There are many scenarios and without knowing the exact conversation, you don't know how horse knowledgeable the doctor was or if they were both talking about the same thing. So I take 'cleared to compete' with a grain of salt

Personally, I think it is way to soon to be competing three horses even they all go Beginner Novice. He has not only been out of commission and loosing muscle strength due to lack of activity, he is also coming back from a near death injury. His body is not ready for all that work in one day.

This is why you get insurance. If you are going to be self-employed - have insurance that will help take care of the bills while you are out of commission. This is true if you own a hardware store or horse business. This way you are not rushing to get back to work to make up the money you lost.

I also agree with those that mentioned the trickle down effect. Where did Laine Ashker and Eleanor Brennan get their 'by any means necessary' type attitude about competing at the top levels? They got it from somewhere. Those around people like Darren and Laine should seriously consider getting the heavy chains out and physically preventing them from competing. It is not safe for them and is not right for the sport.

As far as Darren goes - if you are going to be the Lead of Safety - be safe, not hard headed. Always check with someone knowledgeable that has your best interest in mind. "Hey coach, think I am ready to compete three?" "NO" "OK, no competing three..."

[RAyers]

There is the definition of irony. The head of the safety committee competing after suffering TBI and not following ACCEPTED guidelines used by NASCAR, the NFL, NHL and others. That is NOT a very good example to set to other riders.

At a minimum, I suggest the USEA remove Darren from the Safety Committee, I am sending my email to say that.

Reed

[flyingchange]

Didn't know the table was part of a related distance - that sort of explains things to me a bit. If he was supposed to get a set number of strides and he missed, that explains what happened. I had been thinking this was a simple table set up on its own.

So I guess he dropped off the bank and sort of hiccupped a bit before getting his line to the table? So what was envisioned as a nice, loopy rein, forward 2 stride to a table became sort of an unbalanced, not enough impulsion 3 stride and he missed?

Sort of off topic but I do think putting a table on a two-stride line after a drop is a bit much to be asking at Prelim or to be asking of a horse who has just moved up to prelim. Of course, I say this without seeing actual pix of what kind of drop we are talking about. So I could be totally off base.

Southern Pines Prelim this year had a pretty stiff drop, then bending five strides (or so) to a table. It rode really well, but there were lots of options for you that you could default to depending on how the drop rode for you. With only 2 strides between a drop and a max table, well, you and your horse aren't left with much to work with if things don't go as planned.

[monstrpony]

I seems in many of the recent discussions, primarily the ones about Lainey, there was lots of talk about how ULRs would now feel it appropriate and mandatory for them to talk to a rider who they felt was riding unsafely and say "what you're doing is unsafe; it needs to change".

I wonder what all of those folks are doing now? How many have picked up the phone and called Darren and said "too much, too soon, buddy"?

Or is there a difference between Lainey, an up-and-comer, and Darren, a recognized denizen of the top?

Even after Beth's comment about Darren recognizing the error in his article, or maybe because of that error--it's a pretty significant one, after all--I am inclined to agree with those who are saying that Darren's judgement may not be what it needs to be. I just hope someone, someone says that to Darren before something really bad happens.

[Invested1]

There is the definition of irony. The head of the safety committee competing after suffering TBI and not following ACCEPTED guidelines used by NASCAR, the NFL, NHL and others. That is NOT a very good example to set to other riders.

At a minimum, I suggest the USEA remove Darren from the Safety Committee, I am sending my email to say that.

Reed

:yes:

[flyingchange]

I would think that the person that would speak up would be the owner of the horse being ridden. Two of the three horses he is entered to ride are not owned by him. Really and truely, the buck, in my opinion, at least with those two, stops with their individual owners.

[goobs]

I just don't want anything to happen to him. I am (as we all are) concerned for his safety. I'd like him to be around a long time - he is after all one of the most prominent figures in eventing. BUT there is nothing we (we are strangers for the most part to him, not everyone on here but most) can say or do if this is what he wants. I wish he'd think a bit about those who are concerned about him and how maybe he is being a tiny bit selfish in doing too much too soon. His loved ones will suffer the most if anything happens to him. With all that said, GOOD LUCK DARREN!

I noticed there are only 4 entered in the Prelim division - is it a a soft and easy Prelim? Maybe that is why he is doing it - it's probably easier and safer for his horses to get around a level that has some height and it's probably soft enough for him to do it successfully. Sometimes these ULHs don't pay enough attention to the smaller jumps or don't go as well. Just my very uneducated guess - because there has to be some REASON or Logic behind his decision to do 2 prelims!

[nirvana002]

I understand what you are implying about his mental state. Have you spoken with him about it? I mean, I really appreciate the information you imparted, but it IS a bit of a whopper, don't you think--given the discussions that have taken place? And I will admit, I do think it would have been better aired sooner--maybe not immediately after, but while all the ULR vs. LLR haranging was going on, for sure.

Again, what I mean is, that was a mistake I'm sure a LOT of, especially kinda ambitious, riders might make, wouldn't you say? IF that is what happened with Darren, what a useful example for younger riders. One of those "See, even a highly skilled rider can make a striding/line/track/approach mistake. That's why you need more mileage before moving up" kind of discussion openings. Y'know what I mean?

I agree that it would have been useful information but I was asked by his family at the time to please not share it with anyone. They are not horse people at all and they thought it was not a rotational fall because they didn't know what one was, so they asked me to look at it and tell them step by step what happened. When it looked like he was going to recover, I thought it was the right thing to let him see his video first before discussing it.It was a hard call for me to make for the exact reasons you pointed out. Quite frankly, it has taken a lot of time to get the image of it out of my head. I am glad to hear that Darren called the Chronicle and realized what he had written. Hopefully it was him who realized the mistake, not someone telling him. I have not spoken with Darren. Unfortunately, anyone who knows him knows that he wouldn't listen to me or anyone else. Not that it would make me or anyone else feel any better, but do you think he has to provide written permission from his doctors in order to compete or is his word good enough? Also, are there any legalities in not letting someone compete who is "cleared" by their doctors? I don't know the answers to these questions and I am not saying it should matter.

Jill

[LexInVA]

It's nuckin futs. The guy was in a wheelchair not too long ago not to mention it hasn't even been five months since his accident! If something happens this time, it's gonna be a PR deathblow to the USEF not to mention fodder for the folk in other disciplines who want to destroy the sport.

[roki143]

Ok, so I don't know how to say what I want without being offensive to anyone, but here it goes...

But how many of us have written checks or offered our time to the upper level riders who have had accidents recently? We do it because that is what we do - we are eventers, and we band together in times of need (in what other sport would you tell your competitors to watch out for a slick spot (or something) on course?).

But...

Would we be less likely to rally around someone on their second mistake or accident - especially when it seems quite clear that many disagree with his decision?

Not saying that all the financial support and other help completely covered all his expenses and time, but I'm sure it made a dent. Say he takes a stupid tumble in the warm-up when a horse trips on landing, re-injuring something serious -- would you be as quick to sign the check or offer your sympathies?

[Milocalwinnings]

If he truely was cleared to ride (which I agree with whoever said doctors usually don't fully 'clear' anything;)) then I think one horse at a low level would be ok and a good place to start, but only after some good prep time on his part before hand.

I wish him good luck.... but I'm with you guys and think that three horses at (what I consider to be) a not so low level is a bad idea and a recipe for disaster.:no:

[pwynnnorman]

Didn't know the table was part of a related distance - that sort of explains things to me a bit. If he was supposed to get a set number of strides and he missed, that explains what happened. I had been thinking this was a simple table set up on its own.

Wasn't a table. It was an interesting-looking, inky-black cannon, with cannon balls for a groundline--so, technically, it was just an upright. A bit airy, lots of contrast.

[Jupes]

ARGH!!!!!!!!!

First of all, of course I wish Darren the best, and I hope everything goes well, for EVERYONE'S sake.

With that being said,
Have we not had many, many, many discussions about RIDER RESPONSIBILITY in the wake of Eventing's serious safety issues?!?!?! Is this not EXACTLY an instance where it should apply?! Aren't we ALL charged with assuming greater responsibility, not just the lower lever riders, or the extreme cases?

This is not only about Darren's safety, but it is absolutely about his horses' safety, and the well-being of the sport. This kind of thing has the potential to contribute to the eventual downfall of Eventing...for everyone. I wish this weren't the case, but right now, I don't think riders--especially high-profile riders--should make decisions based on their goals alone. Our sport depends on it right now. Please note, this is just my opinion, so take it for what it's worth, but to me this seems arrogant and selfish!

In the very same issue as Darren's article, David O'Connor talks about whether or not he would have a serious conversation with another URL about possible dangerous riding.

There has been a lot of talk; let's see if there is any action.

[RunForIt]

...what I was thinking.

originally posted by nirvana002:
I am glad to hear that Darren called the Chronicle and realized what he had written. Hopefully it was him who realized the mistake, not someone telling him.

I do hope that other riders, - ULRs and LLRs - who are Darren's friends do speak with him, try to reason with him about competing this early.

On the other hand, ultimately, its not their responsibility. That belongs to USEF and USEA.

[deltawave]

It's not so much whether he is "right" enough to ride competently. He could probably have ridden ever-so-many circles around me a month ago, with his eyes closed and one hand tied behind his back.

What scares me is what might happen if he takes another fall. The brain can only tolerate so much, and re-injury in the months after a TBI is potentially devastating. He got lucky once, I hope he doesn't need to fall back on that again. :(

[deltawave]

ETA, this is making me really kind of freak out, the more I think of it. I just read the article this morning and the more I think about it, the more I think he is just being totally irrational. I don't know him at all, apparently his is a "larger than life" personality so that might be why the tone of the article is sort of "in your face", but what if it is yet another sign that the guy is just NQR?

HELP. USEA. HELP. DANGER. STOP THIS, PLEASE. I'm tempted to send an email or a letter. I very, very rarely do so but this has all my "Danger, Will Robinson" gut-check bells ringing loudly. Who do you think I should write to?

[CookiePony]

I personally want participants in our sport to be perceived as horsemen and women who make good decisions even when our own needs/aspirations go unmet. Darren's lack of judgement can be attributed to his severe head injury. The USEA cannot lay claim to the same reason - someone with the authority to do so needs to call Darren and tell him he is not going to be allowed to ride in recognized horse trials at this point - I would think USEA officials have a responsibility to us all to do no less. JMHO

MHO as well.

flutie/ pegasusmom/ gooddirt/ janet-- do organizers have the discretion to refuse entries?

[Jupes]

Or why not just ride "HC" at Novice or Training, the first time back? Get the competition feel again, and prove to everyone you're OK? No disgrace in that...

[Ajierene]

Ok, so I don't know how to say what I want without being offensive to anyone, but here it goes...

But how many of us have written checks or offered our time to the upper level riders who have had accidents recently? We do it because that is what we do - we are eventers, and we band together in times of need (in what other sport would you tell your competitors to watch out for a slick spot (or something) on course?).

But...

Would we be less likely to rally around someone on their second mistake or accident - especially when it seems quite clear that many disagree with his decision?

Not saying that all the financial support and other help completely covered all his expenses and time, but I'm sure it made a dent. Say he takes a stupid tumble in the warm-up when a horse trips on landing, re-injuring something serious -- would you be as quick to sign the check or offer your sympathies?

The Red Cross has a policy - if you are in a flood for the first time, they will help you rebuild. If you are in a flood the second time, they will help you move. If you haven't figured it out by a third time....the Red Cross has better ways to spend their money than on someone who can't figure out to move out of a flood zone/get flood insurance. (This is defined in a time frame - like floods are less than a year apart or something - don't remember the exact timing).

Something similar could be inacted for eventing accidents. The first time, donations, benefits, etc. The second time, benefits and help to move into a more coaching role or management role. Or only if they spend the rest of the season not showing and move up slowly. The third time - sorry about your luck if you haven't figured it out by now, it is not worth our money.

[SillyHorse]

Like he said in his article, "no one tells me what to do."
Gee, that's mature. :rolleyes:
Too bad his horses don't have the same privilege. Too bad, indeed. :(

[asterix]

Hmm. We are mostly just concerned bystanders here, in the sense that _most_ of us have no real knowledge of his health status, and, of course, no real right to know.
But. He is a public figure in our sport. He is head of the safety committee. The sport is having a crisis right now that involves, among other incidents, the accident he suffered.

He has chosen to take on both the visibility and the specific role in the safety discussions that he now has.

I think he has a responsibility, under those circumstances, to take his own desires, and his own assessment of his readiness, and tack on more time, and more caution, than he thinks he needs.

I don't see how running one horse instead of three would have been a bad idea.

This makes me sad and frightened. Do we have the right to say something to USEA about it? I am not sure.

[Sudi's Girl]

Anyone also notice he's riding two 5 year old YEH's as well??

You'd think with the fact that he's coming back from a rotational fall, and that that particular issue has been discussed recently, someone would be able to speak with him about waiting to compete. It's just so risky.

*sigh*

[Bensmom]

Many have said here that we should be glad that Darren is doing well enough to compete again and that he is a grown up and can do as he likes.

However, not only do his horses not get to make that choice as canterlope pointed out, we were all asked to step in and help pay the medical bills that he incurred as a result of his accident.

And, people did step in -- we had a fundraiser here in Tallahassee and there are armbands and posters out there that are visible reminders that people contributed.

So, it does matter whether the eventing public as a whole thinks it is a good idea for him to return to competition. We helped to pay the bills that helped him recover, though I am sure the fundraising was only a small part of what his recovery actually cost, and I am certain that were he to be injured again, he would again need assistance, considering that many health insurance policies have a benefit amount that can be maxed out for a lifetime amount.

With a recent severe TBI, even a simple fall off of a green horse, where one lands hard on one's tailbone can jar the brain enough to cause a not-quite-healed area to suffer a serious injury.

Brains should be gently cared for, they are not replaceable.

And, to answer the question asked about refusing an entry -- I think that issue is currently up in the air. I know of a situation from many years ago where an organizer refused an entry for a different reason, though a valid one, and they were fined by USEF.

Any organizers with a definite answer?

[Precious Lendon]

I did send an e-mail to the USEA and both the USEA and USEF safety committee e-mail addresses and I encourage others to do the same if you have strong feelings. I am not sure if the safety committee e-mail addresses are permanent, so if anyone has ideas about the best person to e-mail, I would love to hear them.

I think, among other things, this sets a horrible example for younger riders.

[maxxtrot]

i am with the most part of the group that says, this is a very bad idea. i don't see how in anyway shape or form, he can be ready to show that many horses at a show. i have talked to many ULR'S and i guess what ,they have said he is just not mentally right. i also don't think this sets a good example to the up and coming eventers. this accident was just 4 months ago. no way he is ready to be going prelim on 2, training on 1, and two 5 yr.olds in the YEH series. i hope and pray for the future of this sport, and for darren's safety, that all goes well. i too think he should be removed from the safety committy. he needs to practice what he preaches.

[silver2]

Who would determine that "return to play" policy? If doctors say a person can ride, then where is the argument that one cannot? Your idea of return to play and mine might be years apart. I might want to return in six months while someone else says a year, others say 18 months, etc.
The governing body of the sport should! MOST sports have mandatory stand downs for this kind of injury: my ice hockey league follows what is a pretty standard rule in that sport: two concussions below Grade III or one above and you are out for the season. Mountain biking has something similar and most high school sports do too.

The USEA can have all the meetings on frangible pins it wants but if they are allowing someone who just got out of a major coma to compete, they clearly aren't real serious about preventing catastrophic injuries at competition.

I think this also illustrates why depending on personal responsibility to save the sport aint' gonna cut it.

[sfir]

Darren's article has several inaccuracies in it that really should be clarified and must give some question to how clear his thinking truly is at this point. While I am glad he realized his error in the striding of that combination it does seem strange to me that he watched the tape over and over again and the fact that his horse tried to put a 3 in a 2 was not ingrained in his mind. Also, it appears to me that he used the statement that no one attempted the obstacle before or after him as justification that it was not a green horse or rider error that caused the fall but a fluke that could be attributed to the fence design. I was the rider immediately preceeding Darren and my horse did in fact do the straight route there easily in the 2. While I was indeed concerned about the fence design of that particular obstacle due to the fact that it would be so unforgiving if things just went a little wrong, I have to wonder why Darren would not have made very sure the accuracy of that statement before he made it.
Having some experience with dealing with a person with a head injury I can honestly say that the injured person very likely has no ability to objectively gauge what they are or are not capable of doing for a long time and may be very defiant in defending their 'logic'. I hope this is not the case with Darren but if it is I hope there is some way he will be pushed to take it slow. I have to have some concerns that he may not be able at this point to accurately remember striding, angles etc after walking a course if he cannot remember or judge it correctly from repeatedly watching it on video tape. Hopefully I am wrong and it was just a lot of typos on his part.
Ruthie

[jn4jenny]

So for me, here's the real question: If the USEA does not respond to this situation--and we've seen that sometimes the wheels of bureaucracy move too slowly for such a thing--is there anyone at the EVENT LEVEL who can permit/forbid someone to ride when the doctors have already permitted it?

I see this situation as extending way beyond Darren. If you as a spectator/fellow competitor have reason to believe that a competitor is not in a position to ride safely, and you take that to the Rider's Delegate, can someone actually forbid the competitor from riding? And can an event refuse your entry based on the event organizer's/property owner's personal feeling that you should not ride?

Personally, I hope someone stops Darren from riding, but others could easily argue that this is a slippery slope--that if we start allowing event-level folks to forbid (or at least make it very difficult) for people to ride in an event, the political implications are huge. It could get messy. But we also see in Darren's entry exactly the sort of situation where it could save the life of a horse, and potentially of a rider. Tough call for sure.

[nirvana002]

Well I bit the bullet and wrote an email to the man himself. Many of your thoughts and concerns were in it. I am fairly certain I will be crossed off the "friend" roster, but it was worth it...not that it will do any good.

[snoopy]

This decision is especially disturbing as Darren is/was on the safety committee. This sends out the wrong message, in a broad stroke. I am entirely on board with Ruthie and Jill on this. We can talk of rider responsibility, yes, but when it would appear that the rider in question is still having some "diffculties", it is time for intervention. I am ill at ease by this.

[snoopy]

Well I bit the bullet and wrote an email to the man himself. Many of your thoughts and concerns were in it. I am fairly certain I will be crossed off the "friend" roster, but it was worth it...not that it will do any good.



A "true" friend is someone who tells you somethings you do not always want to hear. You did the right thing Jill.

[flutie1]

MHO as well.

flutie/ pegasusmom/ gooddirt/ janet-- do organizers have the discretion to refuse entries?

Only for "unsportsmanlike behavior at a recognized competition." Organizers are not protected in the least against incidents like this and fear being sued. I'm aware that Darren has "fulfilled" all that USEF legal asked of him - questions posed to a neurologist - so basically, everyone's hands are tied. It's a scary scary situation.

Flutie

[flutie1]

Well I bit the bullet and wrote an email to the man himself. Many of your thoughts and concerns were in it. I am fairly certain I will be crossed off the "friend" roster, but it was worth it...not that it will do any good.

Kudos to you Jill!

[sfir]

although I also would bet you are crossed of the friend list. I would bet that list will be getting shorter for a while as the messengers get shot.
Hopefully he will not take it personally that so many people want him to approach his return slowly and safely but there is not much reasoning with a person with a head injury for a long time in most cases.....
Ruthie

[goobs]

Jill - if you are crossed off of the friend list for voicing your concern for him - as a FRIEND - then gee was he really your friend to begin with? We are all just concerned about him. He may even bring home the blue who knows? If I had sustained the injuries he did - I would not even dare attempt what he is doing. To each his own. We just care. That's all.

[luise]

Well I bit the bullet and wrote an email to the man himself. Many of your thoughts and concerns were in it. I am fairly certain I will be crossed off the "friend" roster, but it was worth it...not that it will do any good.

Keep us updated.
Gees, I didn't mean to create a train wreck! But I did notice he was entered, with not one, but 3 horses at least, so that's why I posted it. Maybe for him doing prelim on 2 steady mounts is considered a "lower level course."

[ravenclaw]

I hope someone at the event will be keeping a close eye on him. Not just in the competition phases, but in warm-ups, when doing course walks, etc. And I hope they don't allow him to compete if he seems to be impaired. Can't people be disqualified for dangerous riding? Maybe this could fit under that category.

I don't know how Darren is feeling, but it does seem like too much too soon and a pretty selfish decision. He needs to think about his horses and his family and the sport and how bad things would be if had another bad fall so soon after the one in Florida.

[purplnurpl]

What scares me is what might happen if he takes another fall. The brain can only tolerate so much, and re-injury in the months after a TBI is potentially devastating. He got lucky once, I hope he doesn't need to fall back on that again. :(

A fall is not needed for further damage.
Even a rough drop off of a bank can cause the brain to bounce around.
Or a great jumper cracking your back and giving you wip lash.
Walk into a standard,
hit a tree branch,
WALK UNDER A GOOSE NECK AND NAIL YOUR HEAD!
(which happens all the time we all know).
He ought to be walking around daily life with his helmet on.

Even worse then seeing his name on entry forms is the fact that he is probably riding and schooling as we speak.

Schooling is often riskier then showing.

[purplnurpl]

I hope someone at the event will be keeping a close eye on him. Not just in the competition phases, but in warm-ups, when doing course walks, etc. And I hope they don't allow him to compete if he seems to be impaired. Can't people be disqualified for dangerous riding? Surely, this could fit under that category.

I don't know how Darren is feeling, but it does seem like too much too soon and a pretty selfish decision. He needs to think about his horses and his family and the sport and how bad things would be if had another bad fall so soon after the one in Florida.


Have someone 'watch him' will do nothing.
How many times have you 'watched' someone hurt themselves? It happens before you can sweep in and save the day.

[throwurheart]

When he first was injured I thought two things:

1. I really, really hope he switches to pure dressage. He's a beautiful dressage rider and would surely do exceptionally well. The TBI demands, in my non-expert opinion, a consideration of this route.

2. Not a chance in hell he would.


For the good of the sport, if not for the good of him, he needs to bench himself for awhile.

[mbarrett]

Just some random thoughts. I am no means against Darren competing, but it does seem a little bit early for him to be doing so. I wish him the best, when it is time for him to compete.

I feel it's a huge conflict of interest for Darren to be the head of the safety committee and then compete so soon after his horrible accident. He must not be thinking clearly. If he cannot make reasonable decisions for himself and his safety, how can he make reasonable decisions in a safety committee meeting about other peoples safety? The powers that be need to remove him from that committee.

I agree with many who have already written about this, why after the USEA and USEF have preached rider responsibility so much lately, is Darren being allowed to compete so soon?

I think there needs to be a mandatory "time out" for people with serious head injuries. I am no means an expert, but if high schools, college sports teams, pro sports and other amateur sports organizations mandate athletes are made to sit out for a certain amount of time, why doesn't the USEF/USEA? That's absolutely crazy.

Good for you Jill, for speaking up. If Darren no longer considers you a friend, at least you have a clean conscience. You can look yourself in the mirror and say, "I tried." I hope other people/riders that Darren respect will say the same thing to him.

[Fence2Fence]

I just finished reading Darren's commentary in COTH.

The use of Darren's comment "no one tells me what to do" here is taken out of context of what he wrote. That comment was in reference to comments made after the accident that he was pressued to move Baron Verdi to prelim before the horse was ready.

From what I take away from his commentary, he's not a loose cannon. He has other horseman working with him on how to get back into competition---and specifically named Gina Miles and Robert Dover.

While I don't necessarily agree with his 'accidents will happen' attitude, he's appears to be aware of the risks he's taking and the burden those risks are on the people who support him.

For the most part, the Eventing Forum on COTH has always been a nice place to visit for the amusing, thoughtful, intelligent, rational, non-snarky members...but lately..this forum has turned into a hysterical, howling, hateful bunch.

Time. To. Take. A. Deep. Breath. Folks.

[mademoiselle]

I agree with everybody else.
I took a bad tumble on one of my greenies beginning of June in Indiana (I got a concussion and broke C7). It happened at novice level with a young horse who has been successful at higher level. For a reason that nobody can understand, he just didn't pick up his feet over the #1 of the stadium course.

Well, I'm back riding, but I decided to not event till August. Which means that I'm missing 2 events that are less than 20 minutes away from home (and trust me with the price of the gas, I would have loved to enter those) and that my season is shot. I will not be able to qualify my horses in time for the AEC.

The owners of the horses I have in training have been very understanding and none of them took any of the horses away from me.

I have to ride because I need to make money, but I decided that for now, I will try to take as much risk as I can out of my life.

My accident was not nearly as bad as Darren (I was out of the hospital within 48 hours) and my CT scan didn't show anything, but for 10 hours I lost my short term memory and I was just not right. I don't remember any of what happened that day ... It was still scary enough for me to back off and take it easy for a little while. 2009 show season will come quickly enough !!!
Good for the people who are speaking up

[bambam]

Well I bit the bullet and wrote an email to the man himself. Many of your thoughts and concerns were in it. I am fairly certain I will be crossed off the "friend" roster, but it was worth it...not that it will do any good.
I applaud you Jill- as Snoopy said, a real friend does not always tell you what you want to hear but instead tells you what you need to hear.
One of the things discussed at the safety summit was that people, particularly ULRs whose opinion will be taken more seriously, should speak up when they see someone being dangerous instead of averting their eyes and thinking "everybody saw that coming" when an accident happens. While this was in a slightly different context, the principle is the same and I think the culture change of speaking up is a necessary one to the sport
Good on you Jill- tough to do I am sure.

[MaryKay]

Originally Posted by nirvana002
Well I bit the bullet and wrote an email to the man himself. Many of your thoughts and concerns were in it. I am fairly certain I will be crossed off the "friend" roster, but it was worth it...not that it will do any good.

It may not "change" anything, but in your heart you know you did what you could. Are there other ULR's that are close to him that could be contacted and asked to do the same? Have you talked to him since the accident and if so, does he seem okay? It seems odd that an article that he wrote could be so "inaccurate" on details if he were "fully" functioning.

I don't know Darren personally, but I did as so many others did, make contributions (more than one) to his fund at the equistrian aid foundation for his recovery and so I do have an "invested" interest in knowing that he has "fully" recovered before attempting eventing at any level and four months for the seriousness of his injury seems awfully soon.

And as someone else said-what about the owners of the horses he is riding? What are they thinking????

[deltawave]

Who is hysterical, who is howling, who is being hateful? People are afraid for the guy's life. And yes, for the sport, too. Like it or not, he's a public figure who represents the sport, especially so since he's the figure at the front of the SAFETY COMMITTEE. What happens to his future and the future of eventing if he takes another crack on the head does NOT bear thinking about.

If that's hateful, then I'm guilty of hating--I do--I *hate* this situation.

[RAyers]

I will use F2F's post to point out some problems with Darren's "logic."

Working with other horsemen is good, however, they are not able to judge the mental capacity of Darren. There is a specific battery of tests applied over DAYS that are used to determine that. These are used in other sports before a person is cleared by the governing body to return. This is done because the participant, their trainer, or even their family has NO capacity to judge what is really happening.

While Darren is willing to take the risks, he is serving as poor example to every subsequent rider by also claiming to part of the safety effort (Gina Miles is aiding in this). Right now would be the PERFECT time for Darren to LEAD by EXAMPLE, do the tests, and push for them to be instituted in to USEF/USEA protocol for severly injured riders. WOW, talk about TAKING RESPONSIBILITY for your actions and making a POSITIVE impact on the sport!!!!!!!

As for taking a deep breath, almost every head injury guideline indicates that Darren is making a bad choice. This isn't about Darren's abilities, it is about his LIFE. Yes, he can committ suicide on his own time (as is his choice) but not via horseback (see second impact syndrome and increased risk of death after a concussion) during a competition.

Reed

P.S. Good on ya, Jill! That is what needs to happen to change the culture of the sport as pwynn has so often called us to do.

[hessy35]

Escaping with his life the first time around was a blessing. If he chooses to get right back on then that is his choice.... but it must be worrying his loved ones half to death. IMO, he should takes things just a bit slower and think of others.

[DLee]

But in all reality is the USEA going to have to 'clear' every rider for competition returning from an injury? I just don't see how it can happen. It's a personal choice, no matter if we agree with it or not.

[bambam]

Fence2Fence- I may have forgotten it already, but I don't remember any post being snarky- particularly since many of the concerns about his competing were prefaced with good wishes before they expressed doubt that this was a wise decision.
Even if there were not reports of him still not being 100% (and it appears there are), it is a bad decision IMO for any person who had a grade 3 concussion, was in a coma for 1-2 weeks and took a significant period of time to become independently mobile, starting to compete (on 5 horses no less in one weekend) within 4-5 months of the accident in a sport that requires focus and a constant stream of good judgment calls and where the failure to focus and make good decisions poses the real risk of severe injury. Secondary conucussion injury (or whatever the correct term is) is no joke- it does not take much of a jostle sometimes to trigger it.

[nirvana002]

I will use F2F's post to point out some problems with Darren's "logic."

Working with other horsemen is good, however, they are not able to judge the mental capacity of Darren. There is a specific battery of tests applied over DAYS that are used to determine that. These are used in other sports before a person is cleared by the governing body to return. This is done because the participant, their trainer, or even their family has NO capacity to judge what is really happening.

While Darren is willing to take the risks, he is serving as poor example to every subsequent rider by also claiming to part of the safety effort (Gina Miles is aiding in this). Right now would be the PERFECT time for Darren to LEAD by EXAMPLE, do the tests, and push for them to be instituted in to USEF/USEA protocol for severly injured riders. WOW, talk about TAKING RESPONSIBILITY for your actions and making a POSITIVE impact on the sport!!!!!!!

As for taking a deep breath, almost every head injury guideline indicates that Darren is making a bad choice. This isn't about Darren's abilities, it is about his LIFE. Yes, he can committ suicide on his own time (as is his choice) but not via horseback (see second impact syndrome and increased risk of death after a concussion) during a competition.

Reed

P.S. Good on ya, Jill! That is what needs to happen to change the culture of the sport as pwynn has so often called us to do.

This may have been said or asked, but is there any kind of guideline to when a head injury like Darren's is actually healed?

[1*]

Man; I saw Darren at the safety summit and I agree he did not appear to be "all better". His article in COTH was cogent and logical, sure, but the subtle and lasting effects of closed head injuries of this magnitude are going to be self evident very quickly. Maybe he is the lucky one who will do just great..

[RugBug]

While Darren is willing to take the risks, he is serving as poor example to every subsequent rider by also claiming to part of the safety effort (Gina Miles is aiding in this). Right now would be the PERFECT time for Darren to LEAD by EXAMPLE, do the tests, and push for them to be instituted in to USEF/USEA protocol for severly injured riders. WOW, talk about TAKING RESPONSIBILITY for your actions and making a POSITIVE impact on the sport!!!!!!!

As for taking a deep breath, almost every head injury guideline indicates that Darren is making a bad choice. This isn't about Darren's abilities, it is about his LIFE. Yes, he can committ suicide on his own time (as is his choice) but not via horseback (see second impact syndrome and increased risk of death after a concussion) during a competition.


Absolutely.

For Darren to think it's okay to compete 4 months after a severe brain injury is just dumbfounding.

This may have been said or asked, but is there any kind of guideline to when a head injury like Darren's is actually healed?

Not an expert, but a barnmate was told to avoid doing anything that could cause a fall and result in another TBI for at least a year (forever...if possible). She was only unconscious for less than 24 hours. Injury was in November...she JUST got on a horse again about 2 weeks ago...and he's a super steady eddy.

[YRAP Mom]

It was a 2...Darrens horse jumped off the bank, slightly right, Darren being the great jockey..pulled him back left..and in the horse's inexperience, he tried to put in 3 strides(which couldn't be done) That is all there was to it.

This was a pre-injury split second decision. I pray that there will be no need for split second decisions on these first rides post-injury. Praying a lot!

[RAyers]

This may have been said or asked, but is there any kind of guideline to when a head injury like Darren's is actually healed?

There are no hard and fast rules but I refer you to the Amercian Academy of Neurology for determing when to return to play. Darren was a definitel Grade 3 concussion.

"Summary of Recommendations of Management of Concussion in Sports

A concussion is defined a head-trauma-induced alteration in mental status that may or may not involve loss of consciousness. Concussions are graded in three categories. Definitions and treatment recommendations for each category are presented below.

Grade 1 Concussion

Definition: Transient Confusion, no loss of consciousness, and a duration of mental status abnormalities of less than 15 minutes.
Management: The athlete should be removed from sports activity, examined immediately and at 5 minute intervals, and allowed to return that day to the sports activity only if post concussive symptoms resolve within 15 minutes. Any athlete who incurs a second Grade 1 concussion on the same day should be removed from sports activity until asymptomatic for 1 week.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Grade 2 Concussion:

Definition: Transient confusion, no loss of consciousness, and a furation of mental status abnormalities of more than 15 minutes.

Management: The athlete should be removed from sports activity, examined immediately and frequently to assess the evolution of symptoms, with more extensive diagnostic evaluation if the symptoms worsen or persist for more than 1 week. The should return to sports activity only after asymptomatic for 1full week. Any athlete who incurs a Grade 2 concussion subsequent to a Grade 1 concussion on the same day should be removed from sports activity until asymptomatic for 2 weeks.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Grade 3 Concussion:

Definition: Loss of consciousness, either brief (seconds) or prolonged (minutes or longer).
Management: The athlete should be removed from sports activity for 1 full week without symptoms if the loss of consciousness is brief, or 2 full weeks without symptoms if the loss of consciousness is prolong. If still unconscious, or if abnormal neurologic signs are present at the time of initial evaluation, the athlete should be transported by ambulance to the nearest hospital emergency department. An athlete who suffers a second Grade 3 concussion should be removed from sports activity until asymptomatic for 1 month. Any athlete with an abnormality on computed tomography or magnetic resonance imaging brain scan consistent with brain swelling, contusion, or other intracranial pathology should be removed from sports activities for the season and discouraged from future return to participation in contact sports.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Features of Concussion Frequently Observed:

1. Vacant stare (befuddled facial expression)
2. Delayed verbal and motor responses (slow to answer questions or follow instructions)
3. Confusion and inability to focus attention (easily distracted and unable to follow through with normal activities)
4. Disorientation (walling in the wrong direction; unaware of time, date and place)
5. Slurred or incoherent speech (making disjointed or incomprehensible statements)
6. Gross observable incoordination (stumbling, inability to walk tandem/straight line)
7. Emotions out of proportion to circumstances (distraught, crying for no apparent reason)
8. Memory deficits (exhibited by the athlete repeatedly asking the same question that has already been answered, or inability to memorize and recall 3 of 3 words, or 3 of 3 objects in 5 minutes)
9. Any period of loss of consciousness (paralytic coma, unresponsiveness to arousal)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Additional Resources:

Roberts,William, MD "Who Plays? Who Sits?", The Physician in Sports Medicine, 6/92, Vol 20, No. 6, pp. 66-72.
Kelly, James P. "Concussion," Current Therapy in Sports Medicine. Mosby - Year Book, Inc. 1995, pp 21 - 24.
Saunders, R. and Harbaugh, R., "The Second Impact in Catastrophic Contact-Sports Head Trauma," Journal of American Medical Association, 6/27/84, Vol 252. No. 4, pp 538-539 "

Reed

[nirvana002]

There are no hard and fast rules but I refer you to the Amercian Academy of Neurology for determing when to return to play. Darren was a definitel Grade 3 concussion.

"Summary of Recommendations of Management of Concussion in Sports

A concussion is defined a head-trauma-induced alteration in mental status that may or may not involve loss of consciousness. Concussions are graded in three categories. Definitions and treatment recommendations for each category are presented below.

Grade 1 Concussion

Definition: Transient Confusion, no loss of consciousness, and a duration of mental status abnormalities of less than 15 minutes.
Management: The athlete should be removed from sports activity, examined immediately and at 5 minute intervals, and allowed to return that day to the sports activity only if post concussive symptoms resolve within 15 minutes. Any athlete who incurs a second Grade 1 concussion on the same day should be removed from sports activity until asymptomatic for 1 week.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Grade 2 Concussion:

Definition: Transient confusion, no loss of consciousness, and a furation of mental status abnormalities of more than 15 minutes.

Management: The athlete should be removed from sports activity, examined immediately and frequently to assess the evolution of symptoms, with more extensive diagnostic evaluation if the symptoms worsen or persist for more than 1 week. The should return to sports activity only after asymptomatic for 1full week. Any athlete who incurs a Grade 2 concussion subsequent to a Grade 1 concussion on the same day should be removed from sports activity until asymptomatic for 2 weeks.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Grade 3 Concussion:

Definition: Loss of consciousness, either brief (seconds) or prolonged (minutes or longer).
Management: The athlete should be removed from sports activity for 1 full week without symptoms if the loss of consciousness is brief, or 2 full weeks without symptoms if the loss of consciousness is prolong. If still unconscious, or if abnormal neurologic signs are present at the time of initial evaluation, the athlete should be transported by ambulance to the nearest hospital emergency department. An athlete who suffers a second Grade 3 concussion should be removed from sports activity until asymptomatic for 1 month. Any athlete with an abnormality on computed tomography or magnetic resonance imaging brain scan consistent with brain swelling, contusion, or other intracranial pathology should be removed from sports activities for the season and discouraged from future return to participation in contact sports.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Features of Concussion Frequently Observed:

1. Vacant stare (befuddled facial expression)
2. Delayed verbal and motor responses (slow to answer questions or follow instructions)
3. Confusion and inability to focus attention (easily distracted and unable to follow through with normal activities)
4. Disorientation (walling in the wrong direction; unaware of time, date and place)
5. Slurred or incoherent speech (making disjointed or incomprehensible statements)
6. Gross observable incoordination (stumbling, inability to walk tandem/straight line)
7. Emotions out of proportion to circumstances (distraught, crying for no apparent reason)
8. Memory deficits (exhibited by the athlete repeatedly asking the same question that has already been answered, or inability to memorize and recall 3 of 3 words, or 3 of 3 objects in 5 minutes)
9. Any period of loss of consciousness (paralytic coma, unresponsiveness to arousal)


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Additional Resources:

Roberts,William, MD "Who Plays? Who Sits?", The Physician in Sports Medicine, 6/92, Vol 20, No. 6, pp. 66-72.
Kelly, James P. "Concussion," Current Therapy in Sports Medicine. Mosby - Year Book, Inc. 1995, pp 21 - 24.
Saunders, R. and Harbaugh, R., "The Second Impact in Catastrophic Contact-Sports Head Trauma," Journal of American Medical Association, 6/27/84, Vol 252. No. 4, pp 538-539 "

Reed

Thanks.

[europa]

I am not a Dr....nor do I play one on TV but hello Mary this is over the top!

And............Reed you are just plain scary with your data. That makes me want to put on my tipperary and take up Dressage on a mini full time for safety sake.

[gjump]

I'm the fourth competitor in the Prelim division with Darren.

I'm completely putting myself out on a limb here but if I see anything unusal or unsafe with Darren's riding or decision making I will make a stand of it to the organizers/officials.

If this does happen... what would be the best way to handle a situation like this?

[Mary in Area 1]

My husband just had a fall in which he lost consciousness for a few minutes, exhibited confusion for a few hours. He had 3 broken ribs, a partially collapsed lung and a small brain bleed. He was sent by helicopter to the nearest trauma unit.

The NEXT day, only 24 HOURS after his fall, he was sent home but his team of doctors, including the neurologist, with NO restrictions officially listed. He was even listed, IN WRITING ON HIS DISCHARGE PAPERS, that is was cleared to drive! He was on heavy doses of Oxycodone, and still is, 3 weeks later. The discharge papers don't even say no driving on the Oxycodone!

My husband asked them when he could start riding and they said "a couple of weeks, when your ribs feel better."

Needless to say, I am the enemy. I'v hidden the car keys and withdrawn him from competitions.

Too bad Darren doesn't have a mean wife. This is EXACTLY one type of "Dangerous Riding" we need to eliminate from our sport!

[Arcadien]

Mary, I'd change that to tough-loving caring wife! Kudo's to you. And maybe a good example of what's needed here - friends looking out for each other.

(PS thank for writing him Jill, and sharing your "been there" thoughts & knowledge with us!)

Arcadien,
nervously waiting to see if Darren responds to all the well meant advice pouring on him now...

[Invested1]

While I was indeed concerned about the fence design of that particular obstacle due to the fact that it would be so unforgiving if things just went a little wrong,

Do you have a picture (or a link to a picture) of the jump? Would be interesting to see what you guys are talking about.
Thanks!

[poltroon]

Several years ago, I had a very very mild concussion - so mild that we didn't realize until the day after. I did not go to the hospital for it.

Even 4 months out, I was still doing things like trying to adjust the volume on the TV before I turned it on. Little things that no one noticed but me. I also tired more easily and found it tiring to maintain the intense focus needed to make a safe left turn when driving in traffic. It was nearly a year before all of that went away.

Add me to the list of people who are concerned not only for Darren, but for our sport. He is not the only person who will lose if there is another accident.

Thank you to everyone who knows him who has spoken to him about it.

[J Swan]

Is it possible that this man has had those tests and that is why he stated that two neurologists have cleared him to ride?

None of us knows the details of this mans medical records, nor does he have to allow the public to see and comment upon them.

All of us are speculating and drawing conclusions based on very little information.

He did have a horrible accident, but it doesn't mean he can never return to competition, or take up dressage, or sit out for one year as some have suggested. Folks have worse injuries in car accidents and yet are behind the wheel soon after discharge. And yet those people could easily reinjure themselves behind the wheel or using public transportation.

I'm not on either "side" -I'm just asking if it's possible that his team of physicians, who have Darren's complete medical history, may have concluded that he can return to work. There may be caveats or recommendations we are not aware of - but I don't know that this man needs to disclose private information to the general public.












There is a specific battery of tests applied over DAYS that are used to determine that. These are used in other sports before a person is cleared by the governing body to return. This is done because the participant, their trainer, or even their family has NO capacity to judge what is really happening.

[three_dayer]

one of my freinds little sister had something similar happen to her...got dumped from a horse and was in a medical induced coma for 2 weeks with a TBI..she started riding again, and there was something wrong there...if the horse propped at a jump she would fall forward and almost fall off horse would go left, she would go right, it was like the wires were crossed..(before the injury she was a very good rider).yes she passed all the tests saying that she was 100%and she could go back to her normal life, but she couldn't ride, and finally she had to quit riding, but shes ok doing other sports..yes her neurologist rides, used to event, and she thought that she would be ok, but its just how your body reacts, the brain is an unknown, and you will never know what goes on in there...hope that darren will be ok, and not do anything stupid.

[citydog]

My husband asked them when he could start riding and they said "a couple of weeks, when your ribs feel better."

Again, I don't think most doctors have any clue that there can be more to riding than an hour ambling along on a rented trail horse at a walk.

[bambam]

J Swan- I do not know about what medical tests or approvals he has had but as recently as the safety summit in June, he still did not appear to be 100% and yet was already back jumping at that point- so IMO he has already shown a propensity to do things too soon and take what I think are unnecessary risks. So even if he was 100% the day after the safety summit ended (seems unlikely), 1 month of no symptoms seems too minimal to me to competing on 5 horses including 2 YEH

[Invested1]

I wish Darren a very SAFE and successful event!

That said, if ANYTHING goes wrong, it pains me think of the backlash this sport will take.
"Why was he allowed to compete?" "Why didn't anybody stop him?"

[Bensmom]

Again, I don't think most doctors have any clue that there can be more to riding than an hour ambling along on a rented trail horse at a walk.

I have found this to be absolutely true, and furthermore, that for people trained in medicine, emergency room docs don't seem all that hipped on the wealth of knowledge available about TBIs.

I've known people checked and sent home, often as Mary stated without info as to what to watch for, or any warnings about the fact that a bleed can be subtle and develop into a big problem some hours or days later.

I know way more about TBIs than I wish I did, mostly from a couple of family members experiences. I have found that in order to get good info from doctors you have to do some background reading and have a good set of questions ready.

The info Reed posted is excellent. I had a Gr. 3 concussion years ago, as did my trainer and the emergency room folks sent both of us home with a "gee, no concussion, here's some pain meds" instruction.

Question of the day -- why would you give someone who might have a TBI heavy doses of oxycodone? I realize that it is a pain med that isn't a blood thinner, but still, one that messes up your mental state seems a bad idea when you are still trying to determine just how ok your mental state is.

Jill -- good for you for speaking up and sending off that email, and Ruthie has more experience than most of us in dealing with a brain injury and what effects it can have, even a year later. Thank you guys for weighing in.

As I said earlier, yes, he's an adult and can make a choice, but this really points out an area in which we need to make a change in the sport, and quickly.

If I were an organizer, I would be TERRIFIED that he'd enter something at my event and the lawyer in me would be torn between the liability of letting him compete and the possibility of being disciplined for refusing his entry.

USEA/USEF needs to develop return to competition guidelines similar to the return to play guidelines and implement them pronto -- there is a good reason for an emergency rule!

[deltawave]

Judgement and decision-making are among the hardest things to measure, and some of the last things to come back after any sort of brain injury.

[Fence2Fence]

Darren's piece in COTH stated that he was cleared by two neurologists and the phsyiological tests showed he has made a full recovery. He was also very honest about the risks he was taking, and has other riders involved in making a comeback.

After reading four or so pages of the comments here...and then logging into COTH and reading what Darren had to say for himself, the comments here--while full of concern for him and this sport--do seem a touch hysterical.

That doesn't make me less concerned then anyone here. Yes, I was at the Safety Summit, and agree that you could tell he'd been through the ringer, and yes, I'd like to see him take more time to coddle his brain.

I absolutely agree that Jill and Flightcheck (because of her involvement at Redhills) should speak up. And good for you Jill, that you did that. And good for the riders who will be at the horse trial looking out for him.

But a flood of emails coming from COTH--concerned citizens as we may be--strike me as touch hysterical.

We all have an obligation to look out for each other, but we do need to realize when it is our turn to speak up and then willingly embrace it.

[blackwly]

This may have been said or asked, but is there any kind of guideline to when a head injury like Darren's is actually healed?

Just a little more info about what this entails...

There is a TON of data out there looking at athletes who have concussions. We know a lot about the natural history of the injury, the recovery, and their future prognosis. There is NOT a lot of data published on the functional outcomes of athletes like Darren because the vast majority of patients who have suffered a brain injury like his never see the playing field again. We can only extrapolate from what we know of patients with less severe brain injuries and imagine that Darren's risk of reinjury is high.

When we are evaluating patients with brain injuries to make comments on their ability to return to activities such as driving, working in risky environments, etc we (as neurosurgeons) refer them for neuropsychiatric testing. This is a series of written tests, not unlike the IQ test from hell, which measure cognition, visual and spatial processing, short and long term memory, etc. I am aware of at least a few instances where the results of these tests have been used to clear riders to return to FEI competition. This type of testing is highly sensitive and will often pick up serious errors in cognitive processing even in patients who appear to the casual examiner to be completely normal.

I have no idea if Darren has been tested in such a way, but it would seem to me that the USEA could mandate this sort of testing on any rider who has, for example, been hospitalized for more than 48 hours for a head injury. The testing is rigorous and probably fairly expensive, but I think it would be a straightforward and objective way to differentiate those who were and were not ready to return.

[fargonefarm]

Here's my experience, for what it's worth:
Two years ago I had a young horse flip over backwards on me during a Dressage test at a Dressage schooling show for no apparent reason (though I'm fairly certain horsey had a screw loose in any case - he went bye-bye after the accident.) I had five broken ribs and a partially collapsed lung and was in ICU for three days. The CAT scan (or whatever that thingy was - I was unconscious) showed that I had no signs of brain injury or concussion, despite unconsciousness. Even so I still have very little memory of that day and my balance was a bit wonky for a couple of weeks. My doctors told me no riding for a COUPLE OF MONTHS - any further injury to my ribs would damage my lung. Now - I was back on a horse in a couple weeks only because I'm a full-time trainer and I have to ride for a living. But still - I was only on my steady-eddy and I was extremely cautious. I didn't jump for two-three months and I didn't event again until the following season. And I'm not usually one to wade in the "extra careful" waters.
While I understand that Darren has to make a living - this is just nutty. He can still TEACH! That's what I did. And actually teaching took a lot out of me after my accident.
Darren is and will be a danger to his horses, himself, and possibly his fellow competitors if he competes this soon. Period. Speaking as someone who has had a lessor, but still serious accident. Absolutely ridiculous.

[bambam]

blackwly- you just jogged my memory- I think BE (but maybe it is FEI- I just know about it in the context of Brit riders) has a mandatory set-down period for serious/head injuries and if you want to go back and compete sooner, you have to submit to the kinds of tests you are talking about and if you fail those, you risk being sidelined for even longer than the mandatory period. My memory is a little hazy so I could be messing up the details, but that is the gist of it. It would be worth looking at and getting USEF to adopt some type of guidelines here since I do not think they have them already (and I think it would have to be USEF- do not think there is much USEA can do).

[Tazzie]

I usually stay away from posting an opinion b/c who am I to second guess somebody else's decision? However, in saying that, my biggest concern (beyond my concern for his safety) is that as the head of the Safety Committee he also needs to lead by example.

I am not the first one to post this concern, but I still wanted to add my opinion to mix.

I wish the best for Darren though my gut feeling is that he should have chosen a different lessor path.

[silver2]

the comments here--while full of concern for him and this sport--do seem a touch hysterical.
Not hysterical, realistic.

The sport has an image problem, it is not going to help if the head of the safety committee competes a couple months after a TBI, coma and month long hospital stay and no one stops him. Even if nothing happens this is a colossally stupid PR move: it makes it clear the sport is not serious about safety.

[silver pine]

F2F,
I hate to argue but I really dont think hysterical is an accurate dyscription.
If this were an NCAA sport Darren would not meet the necessary criteria.
If this were the NBA, NFL or NHL Darren would not meet the necessary criteria.

In any of the above criteria if the athlete goes against medical advice and competes- becuase you can always doctor shop untill you get the answer you want- then they put themselves at risk. In our sport we put our horses at risk.

I hope that Darren has wonderfully uneevntful rides and goes clear left right and center. Chances are that disaster is around every turn and I fear for the well being for his horses and himself.

As someone who wourks with TBI patients all the time I can assure that there is no one more sure of their opinion that a high level TBI patient. They often have very poor insight into their deficits, and have poor ability to make quick decisions. I'm not saying that this is Darren, I am not familiar with his specific injury limitations. It is up to him, his medical staff and his trainers/coaches to assure that he is medically able to EVENT.

This is a golden oppertunity for the USEA to establish some ground rules for riders returning to particiation. I hope they embrace it.

[indigoecho]

And............Reed you are just plain scary with your data. That makes me want to put on my tipperary and take up Dressage on a mini full time for safety sake.

I'm going to say that Reed's data being scary isn't a bad thing. A little fear and awareness of your own mortality is healthy. I cringe whenever eventing is called the "horse sport for the adrenaline junkie". I think for the most part, eventers are brave and gutsy, while also having to be disciplined and smart. We also have to cultivate and appreciate all these aspects of our equine counterparts. Eventing isn't all about cross country, but that is what sets our sport apart from the other disciplines, no doubt. When you catagorize it as an "adrenaline junkie" sport, I think you minimize what is great about the sport, the fact that it takes tremendous smarts, discipline and calculation in addition to the bravery. I also think that especially the younger generation, who don't always have that "sense of mortality" need the whole perspective of what eventing is, not just a thrill ride. And they need role models who will show it to them.

I hope that all goes well for Darren, I have been rooting for him throughout his journey as an eventer. However, I think considering the scope of his injury, and also considering today's eventing "climate" this is a bad decision.

[Fence2Fence]

As someone who wourks with TBI patients all the time I can assure that there is no one more sure of their opinion that a high level TBI patient. They often have very poor insight into their deficits, and have poor ability to make quick decisions. I'm not saying that this is Darren, I am not familiar with his specific injury limitations. It is up to him, his medical staff and his trainers/coaches to assure that he is medically able to EVENT.

This is a golden oppertunity for the USEA to establish some ground rules for riders returning to particiation. I hope they embrace it.


At the risk of sounding like a broken record..... Darren's piece in COTH, he's got the go ahead from doctors, trainers, and a fellow upper level rider to guide him back into competition.

It was a well done piece--I wish people would read it.

Yes, I agree...it's a golden opportunity to USEA to establish rules for riders returning after a concussion.

Hopefully they will enact it and make it effective immediately like they did with the one fall and your 'E'd rule.

[yellowbritches]

blackwly- you just jogged my memory- I think BE (but maybe it is FEI- I just know about it in the context of Brit riders) has a mandatory set-down period for serious/head injuries and if you want to go back and compete sooner, you have to submit to the kinds of tests you are talking about and if you fail those, you risk being sidelined for even longer than the mandatory period. My memory is a little hazy so I could be messing up the details, but that is the gist of it. It would be worth looking at and getting USEF to adopt some type of guidelines here since I do not think they have them already (and I think it would have to be USEF- do not think there is much USEA can do).
OK, good. I'm not the only one who knew this. I remember reading about it in William Fox-Pitt's book. He got knocked unconscious at an event, helicopter ride to the hospital and was stood down. In the UK, or with the BE, not sure which, you have to pass a very intense test before allowed to compete again. WFP raised a bit of a stink in the general BE public because he pushed to get passed so he could compete at Samur or something along those lines. I think I recall in his book that he was very worried about passing, as the test is intense...he wasn't sure he could have passed it pre-head injury.

Why don't WE have something like this?

[silver2]

British Medical Rule 43

With immediate effect, if a rider sustains a head or neck injury, with momentary confusion or alteration in mental status, without loss of consciousness, unless completely symptom free within 15 minutes, both at rest and after a short period of brisk walking, he/she will be medically suspended for at least seven days. If the rider is rendered unconscious, the suspension period shall be for at least 21 days.

A rider who is medically suspended for a head or neck injury or for any unconsciousness may only compete again when the medical suspension period has elapsed or when passed fit to compete by a Regional Medical Advisor (RMA) who may act on his own opinion or on specialist advice, or by a person appointed by the Advisor to act on his behalf (a list of RMA's is held in the Horse Trials Office).

If a rider is taken to hospital from an event without having his Medical Card completed by the doctor, a medical suspension of 21 days shall apply in respect of head or neck injuries or unconsciousness.

[J Swan]

J Swan- I do not know about what medical tests or approvals he has had but as recently as the safety summit in June, he still did not appear to be 100% and yet was already back jumping at that point- so IMO he has already shown a propensity to do things too soon and take what I think are unnecessary risks. So even if he was 100% the day after the safety summit ended (seems unlikely), 1 month of no symptoms seems too minimal to me to competing on 5 horses including 2 YEH


I agree - I was sort of playing devil's advocate (I don't do it very well :no:). I've had the misfortune to have sustained concussions; and it was rather disconcerting to realize that I was doing things like putting my coffee in the fridge to microwave it - weeks after the accident.

So I most definitely understand and appreciate the level of concern. I just don't know what his doctors told him. It wasn't a case of going to the ER and get the "treat and street" treatment, or see a local doctor for a recurring headache and get the brush off.

I can well imagine that his fitness and athleticism played a role in his recovery; and it's known that neck muscles can help mitigate certain head injuries. I'm not convinced it makes him able to compete when his counterpart in another sport would be benched.

On the other hand - eventers don't make the big bucks like their counterparts do - and he wouldn't be the first sick or injured person to return to work because they have to pay the bills. I've known cancer patients who are pretty darn sick - forcing themselves to get up and go to work because they just can't afford to stay home and rest. So I wonder.

Who knows what the whole story is. :( I just hope he's fit as a fiddle in mind and body - and wish him the best.

[pegasusmom]

MHO as well.

flutie/ pegasusmom/ gooddirt/ janet-- do organizers have the discretion to refuse entries?


GR914 Refusal of Entries. ... may refuse any entry of an exhibitor or the participation of any agent, trainer, rider, driver or handler who has shown an objectionable attitude or behavior at a Licensed competition or towards its management, which management is able to substantiate, or previous unsportsmanlike behavior at a Licensed Competition which management is also able to substantiate.

Sort of. If "recollection of gossip" serves me correctly this clause was added after a certain competitor sued an organizer who refused his entry.

[pegasusmom]

I usually stay away from posting an opinion b/c who am I to second guess somebody else's decision? However, in saying that, my biggest concern (beyond my concern for his safety) is that as the head of the Safety Committee he also needs to lead by example.



FYI he is not the Chair of the USEF Safety Committee. Andrew Ellis is.

[Tazzie]

FYI he is not the Chair of the USEF Safety Committee. Andrew Ellis is.

Thank you, I apologize, I should get my facts straight before posting.

[RAyers]

However, Darren was/is (?) head of the USEA Safety Committee. Gina Miles took over when he was injured.

[Tazzie]

However, Darren was/is (?) head of the USEA Safety Committee. Gina Miles took over when he was injured.

Thanks Reed - thought I was going crazy for a minute there, so I was right, thank you!

[canterlope]

In addition to being the head of the USEA Safety Committee, Darren is also a faculty member of the USEA Instructors' Certification Program. Since safety is an area that the ICP focuses on rather intently, it seems rather odd that one of its faculty members would conduct his affairs in a manner that runs opposite of the values the program is trying to instill. Maybe this is just a case of do as I say, not as I do. :confused:

[flutie1]

GR914 Refusal of Entries. ... may refuse any entry of an exhibitor or the participation of any agent, trainer, rider, driver or handler who has shown an objectionable attitude or behavior at a Licensed competition or towards its management, which management is able to substantiate, or previous unsportsmanlike behavior at a Licensed Competition which management is also able to substantiate.

Sort of. If "recollection of gossip" serves me correctly this clause was added after a certain competitor sued an organizer who refused his entry.

... AND three guesses who that "certain competitor" was - (and the first two guesses don't count).

[flutie1]

However, Darren was/is (?) head of the USEA Safety Committee. Gina Miles took over when he was injured.

I believe it's the Professional Horseman's Committee, not Safety Committee. I think Gina has taken it over. She was co-chair with him.

[RAyers]

I believe it's the Professional Horseman's Committee, not Safety Committee. I think Gina has taken it over. She was co-chair with him.

Oops, I can't keep my thoughts straight today. You are right, Malcolm Hook is the USEA Safety man.

Reed

[FoxChaser]

As posted by gjump:

" OK... help me out here...
I'm the fourth competitor in the Prelim division with Darren.

I'm completely putting myself out on a limb here but if I see anything unusal or unsafe with Darren's riding or decision making I will make a stand of it to the organizers/officials.

If this does happen... what would be the best way to handle a situation like this?"


Here's someone who will be there, competing with Darren at the show in question who is willing to step in if necessary and alert someone to an unsafe ride if (s)he sees it. Does she talk to the TD?? She did have a good question, but it got kinda lost in the shuffle ;)

[Jeannette, formerly ponygyrl]

Since safety is an area that the ICP focuses on rather intently, it seems rather odd that